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Question about iraq in Ln'L

Rydo

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This whole post referred to a question that received answer and its no longer relevant as there wont be any follow up.

A hug to you all.
 
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ThomM

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Legendary wargame designer Volko Ruhnke addressed your very issue in a Q & A in Aug 2017; here is an excerpt from his take on your thought-provoking question:

I’d imagine it could be quite emotionally affecting for people to play a game about a conflict they might personally have served in, or where they have loved ones actively involved. Do you need to have a level of emotional sensitivity when you’re designing a game like this? Have you had any responses from people who have either served themselves or have had family involved in the conflicts?

VR: I have, and also about some of the COIN series titles, A Distant Plain about Afghanistan, for example. And it’s usually a very positive response. I’ve found that almost universally, folks involved in these matters understand that games are a medium for examination of any kinds of ideas. And just as with any other medium would oversimplify, or take certain perspectives, or potentially get things wrong.

That would be true with a book or a movie or a TV show. It doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t have books or movies or TV shows about very serious matters. And I think that most service members who have served in Afghanistan and encounter my games, as far as I know they’re just happy to have these topics in front of an audience through various media. It doesn’t necessarily mean they think that I got things right, but that’s just not possible.

So as a designer do I have to be emotionally sensitive to the recency of the topic, or the searing nature of the fact that it affects people’s lives in sometimes terrible ways? I absolutely do.

I go back to Gene’s (GMT’s President) original commission to me - the very first thing he asked was if I could do an “intelligent” game on this topic. And my premise is that if I am trying as an educated observer to provide a plausible model of recent history, and if that’s what “intelligent” means, then that is inherently respectful. I’m not trying to romanticize, I’m not trying to make anything frivolous.
 

Rydo

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Legendary wargame designer Volko Ruhnke addressed your very issue in a Q & A in Aug 2017; here is an excerpt from his take on your thought-provoking question:

I’d imagine it could be quite emotionally affecting for people to play a game about a conflict they might personally have served in, or where they have loved ones actively involved. Do you need to have a level of emotional sensitivity when you’re designing a game like this? Have you had any responses from people who have either served themselves or have had family involved in the conflicts?

VR: I have, and also about some of the COIN series titles, A Distant Plain about Afghanistan, for example. And it’s usually a very positive response. I’ve found that almost universally, folks involved in these matters understand that games are a medium for examination of any kinds of ideas. And just as with any other medium would oversimplify, or take certain perspectives, or potentially get things wrong.

That would be true with a book or a movie or a TV show. It doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t have books or movies or TV shows about very serious matters. And I think that most service members who have served in Afghanistan and encounter my games, as far as I know they’re just happy to have these topics in front of an audience through various media. It doesn’t necessarily mean they think that I got things right, but that’s just not possible.

So as a designer do I have to be emotionally sensitive to the recency of the topic, or the searing nature of the fact that it affects people’s lives in sometimes terrible ways? I absolutely do.

I go back to Gene’s (GMT’s President) original commission to me - the very first thing he asked was if I could do an “intelligent” game on this topic. And my premise is that if I am trying as an educated observer to provide a plausible model of recent history, and if that’s what “intelligent” means, then that is inherently respectful. I’m not trying to romanticize, I’m not trying to make anything frivolous.
Thank you for this answer.

The last part opened my eyes a little more. I'm pretty young ( less than 30 ) have never served and have a pretty calm life and sometimes i feel like people can confuse my enthusiasm with disrespect towards history. That is one big reason why i prefer to go "what-if" than historical, to avoid that. But you're right, if done properly and with the right balance it can be a form of respect too.

Best regards!
 

Jeff Lewis

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The topic, I've gleaned, is: Is it too soon for games (and/or conflict simulations) about the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is a tricky topic, for points raised above. All I can say is, in 2008, when Day of Heroes came out (15 years after the events in Somalia occurred), there were a handful of people who thought it was "too soon", but the overwhelming number of people thought it was not and continue to find DoH to be one of their favorite LnLT games. Further, these games are made with the utmost respect for those who participated in the historical events, and they provide a unique lens through which people can see those events, and recreate them, and understand just how harrowing and difficult it was to be there. Our games honor history. It's now 15 years since the Battle of Fallujah, and we have a game on that conflict in the works.
 

Rydo

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The topic, I've gleaned, is: Is it too soon for games (and/or conflict simulations) about the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is a tricky topic, for points raised above. All I can say is, in 2008, when Day of Heroes came out (15 years after the events in Somalia occurred), there were a handful of people who thought it was "too soon", but the overwhelming number of people thought it was not and continue to find DoH to be one of their favorite LnLT games. Further, these games are made with the utmost respect for those who participated in the historical events, and they provide a unique lens through which people can see those events, and recreate them, and understand just how harrowing and difficult it was to be there. Our games honor history. It's now 15 years since the Battle of Fallujah, and we have a game on that conflict in the works.
"Is it too soon for games (and/or conflict simulations) about the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan?"

I asked that question as for me there was no problem but now knowing you're on it there no reason for mine to exist.

Mine was just a question to the community not a critique to those type of games.
 

Paul S Young

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Some time ago, I read a post by an American vet about how gaming the wars he'd fought in helped him deal with some of the bad memories.

I haven't found anything substantial on wargaming as a component in therapy for vets suffering from ptsd, but I suspect it might not be far off.

There is definitely scope for intelligent, deferential games that don't deal in cliche or stereotype.
 
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