RPG and Building Question

[Jack Ruetty]

In the digital game some Bazooka/RPG SWs can now fire from buildings. Is this rule now a rule change for the board game? Just curious.

Jack

 

[Stéphane Tanguay]

This is a proposed rule change but, considering Tom has already implemented it in the Digital game, I'm guessing the Boss has approved it Unless we move back on this, this will also be in the next version of the Core Rules or the Clarifications & Corrections document.

 

[Jack Ruetty]

Thanks!

 

[Barthheart]

This is a proposed rule change but, considering Tom has already implemented it in the Digital game, I'm guessing the Boss has approved it Unless we move back on this, this will also be in the next version of the Core Rules or the Clarifications & Corrections document.

Really?!? Why?

 

[Stéphane Tanguay]

A lot of people were asking for it but, more importantly, it drasticcaly changed DOH scenario, and even some HOTN ones.

 

[Wiggum]

Really?!? Why?

I guess because of realism. RPGs are fired from buildings constantly in modern conflicts and in WW2 Panzerfausts were fired from buildings. As long as you have a big enough room and no one standing behind you its not that big of an issue. It gives the defender more options and im sure its a very common mistake anyway (players using RPGs from inside buildings because they forget about this special rule).

 

[Barthheart]

RPGs fired from inside buildings, in all the video footage I’ve ever seen, has been by a single person alone in the space. The only times I’ve seen it done with more than one person in a space it results in comedic flailing about by all others in the room.
So, if this change really “needs” to be made then maybe with some restrictions.
A single man counter can fire a bazooka/RPG inside a structure with no ill effects.
If the is also a multi-man counter in the structure OR the bazooka/RPG is fired by a MMC, then all MMCs in the hex become shaken.
Risk/reward experience.

 

[Wiggum]

RPGs fired from inside buildings, in all the video footage I’ve ever seen, has been by a single person alone in the space. The only times I’ve seen it done with more than one person in a space it results in comedic flailing about by all others in the room.
So, if this change really “needs” to be made then maybe with some restrictions.
A single man counter can fire a bazooka/RPG inside a structure with no ill effects.
If the is also a multi-man counter in the structure OR the bazooka/RPG is fired by a MMC, then all MMCs in the hex become shaken.
Risk/reward experience.

Its clearly not ideal but i have seen many videos with 2 or more people inside the room. Really depends on the sice of the room. It is clearly not ideal and the backblast will be a pain in the ass but it is possible and a generally used tactics during urban warfare:

Also, individual rooms are not represented in LnL so the 2 men RPG team could be in a different room then the rest of the squad or the rest of the squad or take cover.

My initial idea was to have a random check to see if the units inside the hex (or floor) become Shaken as a result of the RPG fire. Maybe a roll of 1 or 2 on a d6 will result in a Shaken or something.

 

[Ralph Ferrari]

What if an MMC firing the RPG forfeits use of its IFP for the turn that it fires the RPG from a building? RepresentIng the one or two men staying in the room to fire the RPG and the rest of the squad using the time represented in the turn to take cover in another area of the building. If there are multiple units in the hex, they are not affected since they can be assumed to occupy a different room within the hex. If an SMC is firing the RPG there isn’t any additional effects other than the ones associated with an SMC firing a SW.

 

[Thommygunner]

How about choice? A to hit of 1 or 2 to fire safely, representing that the team had to move to a safe place in the hex to fire. Or, no to hit penalty but all in the building hex on that level take a 0 or 1 FP fire attack?

 

[andyl71]

I think there needs to be some kind of jeopardy associated with using one of these weapons indoors. Whether it is forfeiting the IFP of the squad, or taking a morale check. Adds a bit of spice to the decision making.

 

[Stéphane Tanguay]

If you look in the 5.1 Core Rules, attacking such a unit gives a DFT/OFT bonus of +1/-1

 

[Stefano G.]

Hello...i must write i am a bit confused for this new rule.
As many players have already written here, a penalty/malus/risk should be considered for MMC firing AT rockets from buildng. I agree with all the suggestions here proposed about a roll for Shaken (Morale Check?), i consider them adequate without weighing down the game...i do not like, instead, the present rule: MMC firing rocket from building should check immediately for some damage, just after having fired and not be penalized when is fired by enemy reaction (and what about if enemy does not fire against? MMC would go on firing rocket with no penalty?)...i can not image the reason for a DFT/OFT bonus of +1/-1 for enemy fire against this MMC ....of course IMHO.

 

[Stéphane Tanguay]

Hello Stefano!

There was all kind of suggestions for a "penalty" for firing an ordnance SW from a building. The only "set" rules we had was a SSR in Heroes of the Falklands (or A Feat of Arms) that removed all TM for a unit that fired a LAW/Carl Gustav from a building. We decided to use a similar penalty for the "generic" rule. It represent the Ordnance SW firing team exposing itself a little more than usual, to avoid any injury to the rest of the squad, by firing from a courtyard, around the corner of the building, etc.

 

[Stefano G.]

Hello Stefano!

There was all kind of suggestions for a "penalty" for firing an ordnance SW from a building. The only "set" rules we had was a SSR in Heroes of the Falklands (or A Feat of Arms) that removed all TM for a unit that fired a LAW/Carl Gustav from a building. We decided to use a similar penalty for the "generic" rule. It represent the Ordnance SW firing team exposing itself a little more than usual, to avoid any injury to the rest of the squad, by firing from a courtyard, around the corner of the building, etc.

Hello Stéphane...ok, now i can see, but it adds another problem: how to mark and differentiate a unit firing from Building and using RPG, from a unit using only its IFP?
e.g. i can understand that for more exposing in order to avoid any injury when using RPG, a unit suffers a minor cover protection...ok...but if a have a unit in a building, owning RPG; BUT it fires ONLY using its IFP (no SW usage), how can mark that unit has not used RPG and so it will not suffer any malus?....the only "Fire" marker on unit does not allow me to remind if unit has fired with RPG or only using ts IFP....what do you think about?

 

[Stéphane Tanguay]

That is a good point Stefano. I think these situations will be rare indeed, and it should not be that difficult to remember but you could always turn the Fired marker (or the SW counter) 90 degree to indicate so