Is there, anywhere... battle of Hannut scenario?
john connor
Member
No. Not that I know of. But if you have John Tiller's Panzer Battles demo (freeware) then you can get a good OOB from the Hannut scenarios in that to use as a basis for making your own in CO2. Or play the JTS game.
Not the same, of course, as the AI in the JTS series isn't really worth fighting against. You could easily get a H2H game going via TheBlitz.org PBs pages though. Still not the same, as the JTS map is a far cry from CO2 standards, but just a thought, if you really must have some Hannut fix...
Not the same, of course, as the AI in the JTS series isn't really worth fighting against. You could easily get a H2H game going via TheBlitz.org PBs pages though. Still not the same, as the JTS map is a far cry from CO2 standards, but just a thought, if you really must have some Hannut fix...Thank you John. It seems odd to me, that such interesting campaign (1940) gained so little interest among scenario creators. There is so much space for "what-if" or fictional options.
Well, I am going to create Hannut and Gembloux scenarios. I will use Pieter's estabs from "Brabant breaktrough" if he agrees. Any word of advice or suggestion is welcome.
Btw. there is a book published recently. "LES 2E ET 3E DIVISIONS LEGERES MECANIQUES" by Erik Barbanson. Seems to be an ultimate source of information for the battles. Sadly, it is in French only....
Well, I am going to create Hannut and Gembloux scenarios. I will use Pieter's estabs from "Brabant breaktrough" if he agrees. Any word of advice or suggestion is welcome.
Btw. there is a book published recently. "LES 2E ET 3E DIVISIONS LEGERES MECANIQUES" by Erik Barbanson. Seems to be an ultimate source of information for the battles. Sadly, it is in French only....
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john connor
Member
Once upon a time France 1940 was going to be an official platoon level extension to the game, Hubee0, with, iirc, Bill Hardenberger leading development, but sadly, the coding required never got done, I think, and I assume that's now off the menu.
Look forward to your scenarios, especially since I live very near both battlefields.
Look forward to your scenarios, especially since I live very near both battlefields.
So I went on. I've got a map of Hannut area ready. It is based on a 50:000 topographical map of Belgium from 1930's one can find in the web.
I've also got a complete OOB of French and German forces defined in the scenario and estab.
The next step is to set up the deployment of the forces, which can be challenging as I don't really have any viable sources bout 2 DLM detailed deployment on 12 May.
There is another potential problem. 2 DLM wasn't much involved in the battle 12-13 of May as gen. Prioux ordered it to keep securing the southern sector. As a result, 3 DLM had to fight against two German panzer divisions. How to model that? If I make 2 DLM available, stopping the Germans will be easy. If I remove 2 DLM from the map it won't be historical.
I've also got a complete OOB of French and German forces defined in the scenario and estab.
The next step is to set up the deployment of the forces, which can be challenging as I don't really have any viable sources bout 2 DLM detailed deployment on 12 May.
There is another potential problem. 2 DLM wasn't much involved in the battle 12-13 of May as gen. Prioux ordered it to keep securing the southern sector. As a result, 3 DLM had to fight against two German panzer divisions. How to model that? If I make 2 DLM available, stopping the Germans will be easy. If I remove 2 DLM from the map it won't be historical.
john connor
Member
If they didn't take part then don't include them in the historical schedule or on the map. You can put them in a favour Allies schedule instead.
I've got an idea John. 2e DLM was eventually engaged by some German infantry units late 13 May. I can add those units to the reinforcement schedule and make their arrival random (12-13 May) right? That way, player will be able to engage 2 DLM in the north, leaving the south sector weak and risking German early arrival. What do you think?
john connor
Member
I think you should do the historical set up as it was. Keep all the 'what ifs' for alternate favour allies/favour axis schedules. So if your scenario was 12 to 13 May and 2 DLM were not involved don't put them on the map. If necessary clip the map to exclude their area of ops. You can put in alternate schefules to include them and others, but keep the history accurate. That's what I would say because I only ever play the historical scenarios. I like the learning component. And I think that's what the alternate schedules are for.
Ok. There will be three historical scenarios. A short one (12 May 1940) covering area around Hannut (25 km x 10 km) and the skirmish between half of 3e DLM (5e BLM) against the first assault of 4 Panzer Div.
The second will be the battle 12-13 May 1940 between 3e DLM plus some elements of 2e DLM against 3rd and 4th Panzer. Bigger map (30 x 20 km).
The third scenario is also 12-13 May but involves whole 2e and 3e DLM against German XVI Corps. The map covers the entire battlefield (30 x 30 km). Although the scenario is historical, player can make it "what if" by using 2e DLM in the north instead of keeping it along Mehaigne river as per original orders.
The second will be the battle 12-13 May 1940 between 3e DLM plus some elements of 2e DLM against 3rd and 4th Panzer. Bigger map (30 x 20 km).
The third scenario is also 12-13 May but involves whole 2e and 3e DLM against German XVI Corps. The map covers the entire battlefield (30 x 30 km). Although the scenario is historical, player can make it "what if" by using 2e DLM in the north instead of keeping it along Mehaigne river as per original orders.
john connor
Member
Sounds great. Look forward to it.
john connor
Member
Book looks great - and I can read French ok - but the price a bit steep at the moment.
http://www.atf40.fr/ATF40/divers/DLM 1-1.pdf
I don't know if it can help you, found this on Google, something about "division légère mécanique" standard composition
I don't know if it can help you, found this on Google, something about "division légère mécanique" standard composition
I'd seen the page and already have used that. But thank you anyway for your help. I had to dig deeper in order to get more detailed information, because there were differences in equipment between 2e and 3e DLM. Also had to find commander names etc.
That part I have mostly finished. The questions still remaining are:
How was detailed 2e DLM deployment at the start of the battle on 12th May 1940?
Which German units were used on 13th of May in attack on Huy area to prevent 2e DLM from intervene north? Gunsburg (The Battle of the Belgian Plain, 12–14 May 1940) mentions "four units from the 35th, 61st, and 269th Infantry Division". But what exactly were they?
That part I have mostly finished. The questions still remaining are:
How was detailed 2e DLM deployment at the start of the battle on 12th May 1940?
Which German units were used on 13th of May in attack on Huy area to prevent 2e DLM from intervene north? Gunsburg (The Battle of the Belgian Plain, 12–14 May 1940) mentions "four units from the 35th, 61st, and 269th Infantry Division". But what exactly were they?
