By David Heath on Nov 4, 2015 at 2:34 AM
  1. David Heath

    David Heath Administrator
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    Lock 'n Load Tactical World War 2 Era Core Rules Living Edition Beta Rev3

    This is the latest set of guidelines and regulations for the game system. These rules present the core rules for the game system for modules taking place from 1930 to 1959. Notable changes from previous versions of the rules (v3.1 and earlier) will be presented in BLUE text. Feel free to use these rules with previously published modules.

    If you have any game questions, or if you are just looking...[/quote]

    Read more about this resource...

    LnLT-WW2Cover.jpg
     

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Discussion in 'Lock 'n Load Tactical Series' started by David Heath, Nov 4, 2015.

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    1. The Plodder
      The Plodder
      I was just comparing the 2 rulebooks side by side and noticed the contents is missing the 18.0 Indirect Fire header
    2. David Heath
      David Heath
      Hey Guys,

      Please keep any issues or praise coming. This edition are to be consider a final walk through before final release. So keep them coming.

      David
    3. Herb
      Herb
      I'm just very happy to see this, as it foreshadows the upcoming release of Heroes of Normandy, within a couple of weeks I would guess. Very much looking forward to getting that game in my hands and on my gaming table! Have not been this excited about a game release in a long while. This game holds great promise from what I see as a top notch publishing company that is very responsive to customers!
    4. David Heath
      David Heath
      Guys

      We made some updates so feel free to download the manual again and review it.

      David
      Itineranthobbyist likes this.
    5. Qwirz
      Qwirz
      Hi Dave, Jeff and all at LnL!
      Just gone through section 1.0-13.0 and found something I hope might be of some help:

      1.3 Stacking. It could be useful a reference to CAVES along with Bunkers and Multistories buildings, as we can find elsewhere in the book.

      Pag 18, 6.0 just for consistence the parentesyzed exception in the Example refers just to (exception: Ordnance) but could it be better to specify all the exceptions (WT, Vehicles) or "see 5.2".

      7.0 says that laying smoke capability is "delineated in this section". But there is not.

      8.4 Ambush. There are not explained the requisites to Ambush (out of LOS at the beginning of the impulse).

      10.2 states that the upper floor is at Level-1. In a recent thread on BGG we assumed it as Level-2. Is this a change or an oversight?
      10.2 "Units can move from the bottom floor (Lev el-0) to the upper level (Level-1) of their hex by paying two MPs". Should it be added "and viceversa"?

      11.2 Heroes. "Units in the same hex (and on the same level in a Building)....". Should it be added bunker/cave exception too?

      11.5 Armor Leaders. The sentence "If an Armor Leader is forced to abandon his vehicle, he is removed from the Map" is repeated twice: once at bottom of page 33, the other at the end of third paragraph pag. 34. To repeat things is better but if you want save some space...... ;)

      11.6 "Units moving with a Scout (i.e., stacked with and during the same impulse) pay only MP per Heavy/Light Jungle.....". It misses the "1".

      Some of this depend on what you would include in the Core Rules and what will be in Module Rules (for ex. There are no reference to Sticky Bombs/Petard or Hit and Run).

      Clarification Needed: there are some vague reference to Two SMCs crewing SWs. How this is ruled? (It needs they are in the same hex or this has to be stated in Rally Phase along the Swapping/Assembling/Dropping of weapons?)

      Observation: rule 10.3.2 LOS along hexsides, is a dangerous one. It could work well for Forest/Heavy Jungle hexes but is totally unrealistic for Buildings.
      In the exemple, LOS traced along the hexside between two building hexes is blocked, even if it does not touch any building depiction. But what if LOS runs between the same two buildings NOT along the hexside?(for example from the brush hex NW of the germans to the same target hex).
      This new rule assumes buidlings as inherent terrain but just for this specific situation. And this can bring to misinterpretations.
      IMHO the only blocking terrains this rule works with is Forest/Heavy Jungle (or Kunai Grass and Wheat Fields, but their depictions are often already "inherent")
      Not speaking that House-to-House fightings exploit the shooting through gaps and alleys at its best.

      Observation 2: excellent improvement about Plateau Effect (number of shadow hexes depending on the distance to the feature). This is how I've always thought it should work in every game.

      Humble Suggestion: Since Heroes (regardless of Type/Nationality/Color) allow unit in the same hex to Rally, why not allow to Leader of the Same Nationality but different Type/Color to rally troops with a penalty?. I think of shaken men of the 82nd without Leaders for rallying but helped by other US leaders.
      Or SS leaders encouraging Wermacht soldiers (perhaps pointing a gun......). Just Rally, no else.

      Humble Suggestion 2: Why not lower the MF of a Wounded Leader/SMC in place of Morale?

      Have to say that the re-organization of the Rulebook is excellent!

      Thanks for the invaluable effort and time spent in improving our Games!!!!

      This keeps our hobby alive.

      Ruben
      warrafael and Nick DelCorpo like this.
    6. Jeff Lewis
      Jeff Lewis
      Replies in Red.

      Replies in Red below. Note: Any changes made are not going to be immediately reflected in the downloadable file.

      Last edited: Nov 7, 2015
    7. Nick DelCorpo
      Nick DelCorpo
      How will we know when changes have been made to the download file, will the version number change, like 4.12, or 4.2?
    8. Jeff Lewis
      Jeff Lewis
      It's always going to be v4.1. These were posted with it clear that they were not final. I'm not going to change something to 4.1xxxx just because of one change. When they are printed it becomes officially v4.1, and an announcement will be made. Changes made after that will affect rules #.
      Nick DelCorpo likes this.
    9. Nick DelCorpo
      Nick DelCorpo
      Okay, I was just asking, call it whatever version you want, i just want to know when i should download the file again.
    10. David Heath
      David Heath
      Hey Nick,

      I expect the next maybe final but if not I will post it here.

      David
      Nick DelCorpo likes this.
    11. Nick DelCorpo
      Nick DelCorpo
      Thank David, Excited!
    12. Captain Darling
      Captain Darling
      This is a great development, next game we play we'll use the IPad and these rules for reference :happy:

      If we notice anything odd we'll post it.
    13. David Heath
      David Heath
      Hey that will be great. Thank you for the help.

      David
    14. Carlos S. Olivares Pérez
      Carlos S. Olivares Pérez
      First of all I must say that this is a very good work, and that I am very happy seeing how LnL Publishing takes care of its players. Talking about this good treatment has made that one of my friends preordered Heroes on the Nam.

      Here are some comments until section 13.0.

      1.6.2 I would suggest retire from the map a SW jammed for the rest of the scenario. This avoids problems in future turns.

      3.0 "Units in terrain with a positive Target Modifier (TM), including those with hexside terrain like Walls, subtract two from their dieroll". Is this regardless where all the enemy units are? For instance, do you have the -2 on 15K6 with enemy units on 15J6.

      3.0A Medic trying to flip a Shaken MMC to its GO side does not constitute a rally attempt”. Is this also true: “A Medic trying to flip a Shaken SMC to its GO side does not constitute a rally attempt”? If so, the sentence should be rewritten.

      4.0 "Unless the Leader is in the Building and chooses to activate the hex above or below himself". The word "chooses" has confused me. It seems that the Leader has to make an election ("activate above/below" or "activate around"). If a Leader is in the ground level of a Building and chooses to activate the hex above him, does he still activate the six hexes around him on the ground floor?

      5.1ALL SMCs can attempt to Self-Rally whether they have SR printed on the back of their counter or not”. Maybe I am wrong, but I think that this should be in section 3.0, no here.

      5.3 If a unit picks up a SW during its Operation Phase is put under a Move marker (as this have a cost of 2 MPs)? Note that if the unit is put under Moved, it will have a modifier on the DFT.

      5.3 May the OF also affect units picking up SWs? In other words, may a unit that has picked up a SW suffer two OF?

      7.0 "Units firing from a smoked hex must subtract one (-1) from their die-roll". I understand that this is a modifier for the DFT. Does the OFT has a modifier of +1 when a unit is firing from a smoked hex?

      8.1 "If all Melee-eligible units are eliminated, NME units are removed. Any non-Hero SMC left at the end of a Melee round without a possessed Melee-eligible SW or stacked with a friendly Melee-eligible unit is removed too". Regarding the underlined, is there any non-Heroe SMC without a Melee-SW that is Mele-eligible? If not, all is covered with the red text, isn't it?

      In other words, is the sentence "Leaders not carrying a Melee-eligible SW, Snipers, Chaplains, Medics, Corpsmen, and Shaken units (...) are considered non-Melee-eligible (NME) units" equivalent to the clearer "Non-heroe SMCs not carrying a Melee-eligible SW and Shaken units (...) are considered non-Melee-eligible (NME) units". If this is the case, the next paragraph will be reduced to the clearer "If all Melee-eligible units are eliminated, NME units are removed, even if no enemy Melee-eligible units are present".

      8.4 As Qwirz said, Ambush is not defined. I supposed that is when units enter in Melee against units that did not have LOS to them at the beginning of the Impulse.

      10.1 "Units in open-type terrain containing a vehicle do not have to be spotted". I guess this is also applied to a hex with wrecks.

      Does a Vehicle in an open-type hex with Smoke has to be spotted?

      10.2 "Units in a hex adjacent to a hex containing a Bunker or Cave ARE considered adjacent to the units both inside and outside of the Bunker or Cave". According to 4.0 "If an adjacent hex includes a Bunker or Cave, the adjacent Leader can only activate the units outside the Bunker or Cave". So, a Leader adjacent to a bunker-hex is adjacent to units both inside and outside the Bunker/Cave but cannot activate the units inside the Bunker/Cave.

      Page 28. Does the "shadow extension" only apply to obstacles at a level equal of the unit (not to obstacles at a lower level)?

      11.5 As Qwirz says: Armor Leaders. The sentence "If an Armor Leader is forced to abandon his vehicle, he is removed from the Map" is repeated twice: once at bottom of page 33, the other at the end of third paragraph pag. 34. To repeat things is better but if you want save some space...... I added it a third time, just so it's clear. I would add the sentece one more time, just to have it completely clear.

      Thanks again for your good work!
      Last edited: Nov 10, 2015
    15. Jeff Lewis
      Jeff Lewis
      Taken under advisement, Carlos. Thank you. What was up for download was not the final version 4.1
    16. Qwirz
      Qwirz
      Hi there!!!!
      A couple of notes more:

      Pag. 35 right below the picture "Each piece of ordnance has three ranges separated IN TO columns". I can't understand IN TO.

      15.1 last two paragraphs deals with turret counters with no mention to the Buttoned/Open status.
      • "No turret marker is necessary to designate a turret that is facing the front of an OPEN vehicle"

      • "The separate turret markers are used......" I would add "and if it is buttoned or open" at the end.

      17.1 Close Assault. Third paragraph "No Melee-eligible units can be present in the target vehicle's hex. If they are you cannot Close Assault the vehicle, except as noted below."
      I've not found this below....

      18.1 onboard mortars. The reference to FFE marker IMHO arrives abruptly. I would add "place a FFE marker in the target hex." Immediately before "the FFE marker stays on the map....."

      18.3 OBA mission limitations. I can't understand what the terms "sequentially" and "simultaneously" mean. Leaders still activate once per impulse, don't they?
      Or this deals with chain reaction???

      Thanks and Cheers!!!!
      Ruben
    17. Jeff Lewis
      Jeff Lewis
      Taken under advisement. Thanks.

      Grammar note: "in to" means a division or separation, e.g., in to columns. For it to be "into" the subject of the sentence needs to enter or go inside the object of the sentence, e.g., The soldiers moved into the house. Or another example of "in to": We separated ourselves in to four teams. Same goes for "on to" and "onto", e.g., let's move on to the next question; He stepped onto the roof.

      The above is classical usage/style of "in to"/'into". Many have just accepted the lazy usage of "into" as meaning both.
    18. Qwirz
      Qwirz
      Thanks Jeff!
      We never stop learning!;)
    19. Carlos S. Olivares Pérez
      Carlos S. Olivares Pérez
      Some more things:

      1.7 Pivoting has a +1 as the rulebook says, or +2 as the player aid of HotP says?

      14.3Shaken vehicles lose their Acquiring and Target Acquisition markers”. I think that this applies to all ordnance (SW, WT…).

      14.3A firing unit under an Acquiring marker does NOT need to spot (10.1) a target with the same-lettered Acquisition marker”. So, can we say “A hex an Acquisition marker is spotted”.

      16.2 Should “The unit on top of a vehicle can fire in a separate impulse from the vehicle’s movement or AM” be “A unit on top of a vehicle can fire in a separate impulse from the vehicle’s movement or AM or use of its MGs”?

      18.0Indirect fire and Mortar targets in a Hill hex (any level) or in a hex with a Wall hexside do not receive a positive TM”. Maybe this should also be applied to Bocage, Roadblocks, Trenches and Barricades.

      18.1 “except the TM for Walls and Hills”. Maybe this should also be applied to Bocage, Roadblocks, Trenches and Barricades.

      18.1 You can use the term “spotter” instead “Leader/Scout”. This could be helpful in the future if new SMCs able to spot appear.

      20.2Onboard Mortars can also place Starshells, but a GO Leader or Scout must call-in the fire”. It seems that mortars only can only fire starshells via indirect fire. Am I right?

      20.2Onboard Mortars can also place Starshells, but a GO Leader or Scout must call-in the fire”. I suppose that the mortar has to do the roll to fire the starshell. Am I right?

      21.1 Just to be sure. A unit exiting a bunker pay only 2 MPs (and nothing more for the type of terrain of the hex where the bunker is). Am I right?

      21.1 "As a terrain feature, Bunkers do not block LOS, but for spotting purposes, a Bunker is considered blocking terrain". So even if a want to spot units surrounding the bunker (not inside), the Spotting Check to beat is a 3. Or to spot the units surrounding the bunker, the Spotting Check is again the terrain the bunker? I guess the same happens to caves.

      Glossary. I would add HC (Heavy Construction) and LC (Light Construction).

      EDIT:
      18.0
      "Indirect fire such as off-board Artillery and Mortar attacks always attack all levels of a Building and, in hexes containing a Bunker or Cave". As mortars can also make Direct Fire, this should be also noted for Mortar Direct Fire "Direct Fire done by mortar attacks always all levels of a Building...". I think that mortar fire (direct or indirect) and OBA attack both Vehicles and non-Vehicles units in their attacks, but I do not find this in the rules.
      Last edited: Nov 14, 2015
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