By simovitch on Jul 31, 2017 at 9:19 AM
  1. simovitch

    simovitch Member

    Nov 15, 2014
    Likes Received:
    Hi all,

    I thought I would copy this thread from the CO2 Dev Forum just to keep you abreast of development work we are doing. This is just one of the issues we have been working our way through recently. I'm aiming to release a new dev build 5.1.30 by the end of the week. If the testers come back with the all clear then we'll aim to get out a release version for you all to update your game engine and modules.

    Dave O'Connor


    5.129 Debug:
    This is a test scenario that Daz sent me last year to illustrate how a unit will get supplied even if the single forest road between it and the supplying base is completely interdicted by enemy units.

    I ran the game for 3 days and every supply column got through.

    Attached Files:

    #1 simovitch, Jul 31, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 21, 2017
    Daz likes this.


Discussion in 'Command Ops Series' started by simovitch, Jul 31, 2017.

    1. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      A grid scale would help me analyse this. How far is it between the US mbase and the German blocking position?

      How much APer FP is there in the blocking group?

      What is the current weather?

      What is the visibility at the blocking location?
    2. simovitch
      about 1Km between base and roadblock.
      clear pattern, ground ice.
      visibility is good but I don't think any allied units ever spotted the enemy block because of the terrain. Would that make a difference in the game (which would be a bug I assume)?
    3. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Interesting. Thanks for the info Richard. Can you send me a save, please?
    4. jimcarravallah
      I'm doing a full run through of Hamich Ridge as the allies. Just got a message that one of my units was cut off from supply after a regular supply (1800 distribution) run resulted in the supply column suffering a 24-percent loss.

      The unit is located along a road in the southwest wooded area of the map. It is dark, and there is no evidence of a spotted enemy unit along the route. The other units which would have had their regular supply runs along the same route both north and south of the unit did not report any issues.

      So long as the unit doesn't disband, I'll do some serial saves as this plays out to see if there are any emergency supply requests by the unit, and and if they are cancelled until evaluations conducted during the next few regular supply distribution runs changes any status.
    5. simovitch
      Jim, do you ever use the dev tools in the debug to observe the other side?
    6. simovitch
      Jim, do you ever use the dev tools in the debug to observe the other side?
    7. jimcarravallah
      No, Richard,

      I'm not familiar with how to use them.

      Where can I get some information on how to use those tools?
    8. jimcarravallah

      I found the instructions.

      Will use the dev tools now as I play through.
    9. jimcarravallah
      Here's my puzzle with supply.

      The message log states the supply column from 1 Inf Div base to Mortar Platoon 2/26 Infantry Regiment sufferred a 47-percent loss and a subsquent message indicates the supply route is blocked. 2/26 is off a road in a wooded area, but the road network between the base is not blocked and the distance into the woods is less than 300 meters.

      The remaining units from 26 Infantry Regiment have no issues with supply, and the more direct route to them from the same base would run nearer enemy units than the route to the 2/26 platoon, which is well separated from the remaining units in the regiment.

      Attached Files:

    10. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      OK, I stepped through the saved game Richard sent me. I waited till the SupplyTransportEvent occurred for the A Coy down south. I stepped through the process event function and confirmed that it was, in fact, using actual enemy firepower rather than the friendly estimate. However, it was using the average actual enemy firepower along the route rather than the maximum. I changed it to use the max value and the column suffered 40% losses. I did note that it still delivered the rest. I don't think that's right. So I have amended the code so that if it suffers more than 30% it will abort and return to base and the receiver's supply line status will change to "cut". Less than 30% but more than zero and it will go on to deliver its goodies but the status will be "threatened".

      I'm reviewing the code now to see how I can mitigate large columns from being wiped out. In practice, they would be spread out over a fair distance and would turn around if the leading vehicles were destroyed. I'll report back once I have worked out how best to handle this.
    11. jimcarravallah
      Here's the update to the supply issue.

      The 2/26 Mortar Platoon is now in the midst of the other 26 Regiment Units.

      It still shows a blocked supply line while the remaining units are in supply from the same depot.

      It would indicate there is more going on beyond a blocked supply path causing this issue.

      I've attached the save when I first noticed the message of a blocked supply route (also attached in my first post on this issue), and the status an hour and a half later when the placement of the unit changed, with no change in status.

      Attached Files:

    12. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Thanks Jim, I'll take a look as soon as I recover from this mid winter cold that struck with a vengeance yesterday. It's always a bit problematic bug hunting with a tissue stuck up your nose.
    13. jimcarravallah
      Thanks Dave,

      I'm not anxious over the matter, just want to make sure any test information gets to you in a timely manner.

      Wish I could send you some of the summer sun here to help with the cold.
    14. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      It rained all day here with a max temp of 10C. It complemented my condition. ;)
    15. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Back on deck today after ten days of wretched cold. Revised the SupplyTranbsportEvent's function for determining losses. Here is the code I wrote to determine losses to vehicles in the supply column:

      // Loop through the vehicles and determine if the currVehicle is hit
      // and if the column will abort its mission
      // This is designed to achieve a situation where a standard inf coy can block a supply route
      pf hitProb = inEnemyFP >= 9 ? pf(0.9) : pf(inEnemyFP/pf(10.0));
      pf abortProb = pf(0.2);
      pf randomHit = pf(0.0);
      pf randomAbort = pf(0.0);

      for( int i = 0; i < vehicleCount; i++ )
      randomHit = FPRandom::Rand();

      if( randomHit <= hitProb )

      randomAbort = FPRandom::Rand();

      if( randomAbort <= abortProb )
      outWillAbort = true;

      I started stepping through the code using the SupplyTest saved game where the Germans block the road in the forest. But before I got the event I had experienced previously, it hit another event for the resupply of the 17th Abn Corp Base to the CCA 7AD Base. This is at the top of the map. It reckoned the German firepower influence there was a value of 2. It's about 2kms away from the actual German road block. I thought this can't be right. It's night time. Sure enough, the map overlay for the German APer firepower does indicate there is some FP there.

      Supply Test #1.jpg

      I checked the way it calcs the firepower maps and it takes into account the weather factors including moon phase. That's when I noticed that there is no UI method for telling me what the current moon phase is. So I stepped into the code and saw that it was full moon. I then did a search to determine where this was set. The MapMaker sets the percentage modifier. I assumed the ScenMaker would set the moon phase. But alas it's not included in the Weather dialog within ScenMaker. I then checked the code to see if this was calced. It's not. It simply initialises the mooin phase member to full moon and while there is a function to set the value, it's never called. So every scenario is always full moon. Very sad.

      I've done a bit of research and got my hands on an algorithm to calc the moon phase. I'm going to have to make some mods to the member so it can interface correctly. But hopefully I can get this working soon.
    16. jimcarravallah
      Good catch, Dave.

      Not to throw a monkey wrench in, but I will ;-)

      There would be a similar detriment to visibility range relating to supply column interdiction in rainy / snowy weather.
    17. Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor
      It's only a wrench if the throw hurts the recipient. ;) Actually, it also takes into account the weather conditions. Thankfully, these are being set in the ScenMaker, so that's all good.

      One question though, given a clear night with a full moon, do you think you could effectively see a truck 2 clicks down a road (assuming no blocking terrain)?
    18. simovitch
      IMO you would hear it and see it if clear LOS, but I don't think you should be able to effectively target it.
    19. jimcarravallah
      I agree.

      At 2K with a full moon you're not only dealing with ability to discern a viable target, but also deciding whether its markings are friend or foe.

      This is off on a tangent, but maybe there's room for a future command and control nuance dealing with an "offensive interdiction" choice for the player. What I envision is a definition of a "free fire zone" concept where a unit is emplaced, and authorized to fire at any visible target that enters a zone the player has declared free of everything but enemy units.

      Won't fall on my sword promoting it, but it is a command and control alternative that was available to commanders.

      For the more sophisticated player, it would offer options for interdicting rear area troop movement paths and likely supply lines.

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