Scenarios Command Ops 1 vs 2

[keoman]

Question. I own Command Ops 1 with the Bulge, Market Garden and Greece modules. Are these modules any different from the modules available for Command Ops 2? Will I be getting the same scenarios that I already play on CO 1? Or are their differences? Thanks for you input.

 

[jimcarravallah]

Question. I own Command Ops 1 with the Bulge, Market Garden and Greece modules. Are these modules any different from the modules available for Command Ops 2? Will I be getting the same scenarios that I already play on CO 1? Or are their differences? Thanks for you input.

All the CO1 commercially designed scenarios were reviewed and most updated for CO2.

I'm sorry, I no longer have my BFTB install for comparison, but If I recall, there were a few scenarios, mainly stand alone "What If?" variants that were redundant with existing scenarios and available with the start game variables (more or less supply, more or less reinforcements, etc.) that were dropped.

The packaging of scenario packs also changed (the Bulge scenarios were split into two packs -- one dealing with the Axis assault, and the other dealing with the Allied Counterattack; the Battles for Greece scenarios were split into two different packs (one dealing with the North Africa scenarios and the other dealing with the Greek / Mediterranean scenarios) with new scenarios added in each and the Highway to the Reich Pack had scenarios added.

The big benefit of CO2 was implementation of an improved combat system than was available with the CO1 engine and regular updates being made available to build on that.

 

[keoman]

Thanks for the info. Sounds like I should upgrade the scenarios and move exclusively to CO2 because of the updates, etc.

 

[hubee0]

Thanks for the info. Sounds like I should upgrade the scenarios and move exclusively to CO2 because of the updates, etc.

CO2 scenarios have been improved compared to CO1. But if you still want to use old ones with the new engine, there is an option. Run Scenario Maker from CO2 5.1.28. You will be able to open CO1 scenarios and save them in newer format. Such conversion is not possible in 5.1.31.
It worked for me with BFTB scenarios. I don't know if it does for HTTR or COTA.

 

[Dave 'Arjuna' O'Connor]

CO2 scenarios have been improved compared to CO1. But if you still want to use old ones with the new engine, there is an option. Run Scenario Maker from CO2 5.1.28. You will be able to open CO1 scenarios and save them in newer format. Such conversion is not possible in 5.1.31.
It worked for me with BFTB scenarios. I don't know if it does for HTTR or COTA.

That shouldn't work on the release version of the ScenMaker. In any event the new upgrade to the engine will require a complete conversion of all data. So they won't work under the new upgraded engine.

BTW please remember that our business model sees us giving away the Core engine for free. We make our money (such as it is) from selling the modules. So please, respect that.

 

[hubee0]

Hi Dave,
I respect the fact, that one has to buy the NEW (improved) scenarios in order to play them. But if someone had bought the OLD ones and you provided (even by mistake) a way to use them with the new engine, I think it is absolutely fair from your customers to take advantage of that.
Especially, if you don't offer an "official" way to convert user made scenarios from CO1 to CO2. Am I right?

That shouldn't work on the release version of the ScenMaker. In any event the new upgrade to the engine will require a complete conversion of all data. So they won't work under the new upgraded engine.

Does it mean, that custom made scenarios which work for the current version of CO2 (5.1.31) won't work with the new release? Or you''ll give a tool to convert them? What with the existing scenarios for CO2 which I have bought?
BTW. As a developer, I would make a clear distinction between commercial and user made scenarios. Only the latter could be edited and modified in the ScenMaker. Commercial ones might be encrypted and tied to the CO2 license key somehow. That would solve the problem IMHO.

 

[ioncore]

BTW. As a developer, I would make a clear distinction between commercial and user made scenarios. Only the latter could be edited and modified in the ScenMaker. Commercial ones might be encrypted and tied to the CO2 license key somehow. That would solve the problem IMHO.

Dave, this.

 

[jimcarravallah]

BTW. As a developer, I would make a clear distinction between commercial and user made scenarios. Only the latter could be edited and modified in the ScenMaker. Commercial ones might be encrypted and tied to the CO2 license key somehow. That would solve the problem IMHO.

This has been discussed.

One of the matters with CO2 is that commercial scenarios, maps, and estabs are available for cloning into modifications.

I'd hope the encryption wouldn't limit that option, but instead would prohibit a person who clones or modifies data for a commercial scenario from using the original scenario's / map's / estab's name for their work.

 

[GoodGuy]

This has been discussed.

One of the matters with CO2 is that commercial scenarios, maps, and estabs are available for cloning into modifications.

That may be the only way for a novice scenario designer to get a first (and quick) result, though: modifying stock scenarios helps to understand the do's and don'ts when placing objective circles and setting their priority levels etc., and when creating proper reinforcement schedules. Once these basics are understood, then a novice can use the map maker and create his own unique/historical/what-if content.
For instance, I added the bulk of the Pz.-Lehr-Division and a formation that almost amounted to the size of an INF divison to the German reinforcement schedule in the original Arnheim main scenario of the original HTTR, back then, while adding 1 or 2 divisions to XXX Corps, to spice things up and make the scenario more challenging. I did the same with the Nijmegen scenario (which was the scenario with the highest number of troops already, even before i altered it, as the stock scenario contained 200+ units), and it turned out to be an extreme challenge and heaps of fun.

If a novice starts a map from scratch, he will then struggle the most with the elevation layers, most likely, and it will take a lot of trial and error or even studying some forum feedback to get proper results and to translate the elevations from a paper map to a proper amount (and increments) of elevation layers in the map maker, even if he has historical or modern elevation maps at his disposal. If community designers can import GIS data, there might be less need for cloning and modifying and designers can focus on eye candy and historical accuracy (like historically accurate road networks, proportions of villages and woods and alignment of fortifications).

I'd hope the encryption wouldn't limit that option, but instead would prohibit a person who clones or modifies data for a commercial scenario from using the original scenario's / map's / estab's name for their work.

Do you mean a commercial scenario or module that's slightly modified and offered by a third party (or user) that's not affiliated with Panther?
I don't see something like that coming up anytime soon. And even if so, small modifications in the game engine and scenmaker via update could then deny widespread usability of such content, in addition to Steam's or LnL's legal measures.

 

[keoman]

Hey, just so everyone knows, I intend to buy the CO2 new scenarios. I have already bought two modules. I would really like to see a France '40, more North Africa and some East Front scenarios. Also, would love to see some France '14 scenarios, or late war WWI, like the KaiserSchlacht. Would buy them too. Like the game.

 

[Rosseau]

All I know is without the ability to modify the stock scenarios, I am a dead man and the game loses all appeal (for me). I'm not sure I follow all of the discussion above, but I'm sure this would never happen. But yes, we all need to get on board with CO2 modules (as I have done), and very cool the OP is considering the same. "Giving away" the base game is like a demo, and is quite generous compared to say... Battlefront